PDF workflows... Is there file integrity?

[Ear]

Yep. Mine is a mixture of both.

NORM = Normalize Once Render Many... this can cause problems like the Rep was eluding to where a file can render differently from one machine to another. I have seen problems, (few and far between) with this. When I run proofs to my Epson, for example, it does it's own rendering separate from the plate screen set and I have seen a problem or two, maybe .01%.

ROOM = Render Once Output Many... This is more accurate but results in handling larger files (sometimes). Most RIPS use a low res set for placement in Preps (or other imposition software) which speeds things up tremendously. These files are FPO and get replaced with the high res screened files before releasing to plate. My HP Spinjet proof descreens the actual plate tiffs resulting in 100% accurate content on the proof. I also use late placement imposition meaning I can make a change to the imposed job in the workflow and send to plate or proof without having to open the prep again, it's freakin slick!

As far as speed, most new rips and the computers they are installed on are brutally fast and can chew through either ROOM or NORM job tickets in no time.

[jezza]

I just dealt with a printer that wanted a Collect/Package  :cry: pdf/x wasn't any good. I knew I should have brokered the job  :shocked:

[Aaron]

Very interesting. Man learning is fun!!  :grin:

So a true PDF workflow is NORM (file integrity from one device to another is so-so). But everyone is doing it... how dangerous could it be...  :wink:

So the options are: ROOM = more file integity but slower rips with larger files. NORM = faster rips but small chance of file integrety issues.

And a fully automated workflow (customer can upload files, the rip rips it, and reposts online to client without a prepress tech touching the files) can only be acheived through a pdf workflow, right?

[born2print]

Me too David, in fact I'm ripping one right now
 :undecided: <----nnnnnnnngheh

[jezza]

There are several ways of achieving auto ripped uploads if I understand you corrcetly. Check out Dalim TWiST workflow.

http://www.dalim.com/en/products/twist/

There are others, and this might start a flame war, but TWiST works well. Not cheap though

(Edited for typos)

[ninjaPB_43]

Very interesting. Man learning is fun!!  :grin:

So a true PDF workflow is NORM (file integrity from one device to another is so-so). But everyone is doing it... how dangerous could it be...  :wink:

So the options are: ROOM = more file integity but slower rips with larger files. NORM = faster rips but small chance of file integrety issues.

And a fully automated workflow (customer can upload files, the rip rips it, and reposts online to client without a prepress tech touching the files) can only be acheived through a pdf workflow, right?

No, I believe with Switch or any of its flavors, you can automate even if customers are uploading natives...but someone correct me if Im wrong, I only demo'd Switch..

also fwiw, I dont think there is a "TRUE fully automated workflow", there will still be some user intervention somewhere in the flow of jobs..

[Joe]

Very interesting. Man learning is fun!!  :grin:

So a true PDF workflow is NORM (file integrity from one device to another is so-so). But everyone is doing it... how dangerous could it be...  :wink:

So the options are: ROOM = more file integity but slower rips with larger files. NORM = faster rips but small chance of file integrety issues.

And a fully automated workflow (customer can upload files, the rip rips it, and reposts online to client without a prepress tech touching the files) can only be acheived through a pdf workflow, right?

I've found that with my customers this is a pipe dream. Others customers mileage may vary.

[Joe]

Very interesting. Man learning is fun!!  :grin:

So a true PDF workflow is NORM (file integrity from one device to another is so-so). But everyone is doing it... how dangerous could it be...  :wink:

So the options are: ROOM = more file integity but slower rips with larger files. NORM = faster rips but small chance of file integrety issues.

And a fully automated workflow (customer can upload files, the rip rips it, and reposts online to client without a prepress tech touching the files) can only be acheived through a pdf workflow, right?

No, I believe with Switch or any of its flavors, you can automate even if customers are uploading natives...but someone correct me if Im wrong, I only demo'd Switch..

also fwiw, I dont think there is a "TRUE fully automated workflow", there will still be some user intervention somewhere in the flow of jobs..

Oh there is if you have customer supplied perfect files. Never seen one of the critters myself but I've heard others have spotted them. Where is Matt when you need him?  :cheesy:

[born2print]

LOL!
I think there's a magical kingdom called "publications" where the files always come in perfect and consistent and the schedule never changes...
um, what was the question? I was just day-dreaming

[Aaron]

Ya, obviously not all clients would be able to use an auto-post workflow, but I have a few clients that are smart enough and "usually" know what they are doing and could benefit from it.

And I understand there is no true complete automated workflow. the impo and college kid at the platee box is still needed. But the auto rip and post would be cool.

[born2print]

This may interest you as well:
https://www.b4print.com/forums/index.php?topic=189.0

[ninjaPB_43]

yep, automation is indeed cool..  but also expensive..  so really it depends on your shops particular needs and the ROI on any investments you would make like spending  close to $3000 for Pitstop Server, and then another several thousand on Switch, and then...   

[Ear]

There are several ways of achieving auto ripped uploads if I understand you corrcetly. Check out Dalim TWiST workflow.

http://www.dalim.com/en/products/twist/

There are others, and this might start a flame war, but TWiST works well. Not cheap though

(Edited for typos)

I've never actually used Dalim but I have prepress friends that have compared it to and worked with many others and I understand it to be one of the top in not the best workflow out there, but it'll cost ya!

[Joe]

I've never actually used Dalim but I have prepress friends that have compared it to and worked with many others and I understand it to be one of the top in not the best workflow out there, but it'll cost ya!

I had a demo at Graph Expo in Oct. 2006. Very impressive as was the price.  Was cheaper than Apogee X though.

[Aaron]

Well let me post this dangerous question:

Anyone like the NORM of Pinergy better then Rampage or vise versa? Or is NORM the same thing on any workflow software?