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Harmony Issues and Recommendations
by johnny_jay
February 12, 2018, 02:51:16 PM


Topic: Harmony Issues and Recommendations (Read 303 times) previous topic - next topic

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Harmony Issues and Recommendations
Hola,

First time poster, but been visiting this site for a bit, thank you for this.

1st question. When editing the calibration curve moving the node up does it lighten the screen value? as in moving the cyan value at 50 node (reading a 52 on press sheet) and inputting the node value 66 to 67. is that correct? or am i going the wrong way?

2nd question. After making the change nothing happens, is this a bug I read under this Topic: Plate Curves with Harmony in Prinergy? And does restarting Prinergy fix this, or will I have to redo the curve as Joe said he did.

3rd question. We recently switched to Fugi Superia Econmaxx-T plates (process-less), and they sent a tech in to get the plate up and going, he did put in a plate curve but no paper curve. when calibrating the paper curve should I still be using his plate curve?

We are using a X-Rite 500 Series Spectrodensitometer for CMYK values off the press sheet with no tint swatch and yes I work in a shop that values cheapness over getting things done correctly.

Any help and tips will be grateful. Thank you.
  • Last Edit: February 07, 2018, 03:38:28 PM by macVato

  • Joe
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Re: Harmony Issues and Recommendations
Reply #1
Any time I need to make a change I create a new calibration curve or else Prinergy does not see the changes. Don't know why but that is what happens for me.

When you create a new calibration curve you have to use a 'Current Curve' and a 'Target Curve' to make your calibration curve. Usually the current curve is your plate curve which is making the plate Linear. That means you start your 'Target Curve' at Linear. For your target curve I usually duplicate the previous 'Target Curve' and when I assign the  'Current Curve' and a 'Target Curve' I use the duplicated 'Target Curve'. Then you change your values in the 'Target Curve'. At the 50% mark if you enter a 52 you are increasing the value on the plate. You usually want to go lower to compensate for dot gain. For example here is the latest numbers we put in for our calibration curve.
Mac OS 10.12 Sierra | Prinergy 7.5 | Adobe Creative Cloud 2017 | Two Luscher XPose 160 CTP units

Prepress: One who does precision guess work based on unreliable data provided by those of questionable knowledge.

Re: Harmony Issues and Recommendations
Reply #2
So for fine tuning I should edit the target curve, not the calibration curve.

Thank you.

  • Joe
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  • Administrator
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Re: Harmony Issues and Recommendations
Reply #3
Well you know I guess I never went back straight to the target curve and edited it. I tried editing it from within the calibration curve. Not sure if it will make a difference but it is worth a try.
Mac OS 10.12 Sierra | Prinergy 7.5 | Adobe Creative Cloud 2017 | Two Luscher XPose 160 CTP units

Prepress: One who does precision guess work based on unreliable data provided by those of questionable knowledge.

Re: Harmony Issues and Recommendations
Reply #4
I never update the calibration curve. If making just a slight change, I copy the target and edit that and then create a new calibration curve.

We usually don't edit an older curve but when I fingerprint a press I will name the curve with the press and date and add C1 at the end, then if I copy I will make that C2. That way if I botch something up, I always have my older one to go back too.

John
Kodak Prinergy
Preps 8
Epson 9800 and 9890
Screen 16000N
Screen R36000ZX
Kodak Insite for file submission and proofing

  • Joe
  • [*][*][*][*][*]
  • Administrator
  • Master of Nothing
Re: Harmony Issues and Recommendations
Reply #5
I never update the calibration curve. If making just a slight change, I copy the target and edit that and then create a new calibration curve.

We usually don't edit an older curve but when I fingerprint a press I will name the curve with the press and date and add C1 at the end, then if I copy I will make that C2. That way if I botch something up, I always have my older one to go back too.

John

That is the way I am doing it also. Mainly because back when I tried to edit the calibration curve I never saw the changes that I made. It does have the side benefit too that you can go back to the previous one if needed to.
Mac OS 10.12 Sierra | Prinergy 7.5 | Adobe Creative Cloud 2017 | Two Luscher XPose 160 CTP units

Prepress: One who does precision guess work based on unreliable data provided by those of questionable knowledge.

Re: Harmony Issues and Recommendations
Reply #6
I do it slightly different from Joe but get the same result. We do not linearize, so my current is just 10=10, 20=20 etc and target is the number i get from Curve 3 when we run a fingerprint.

I need to start looking at Colorflow since Harmony is being phased out but I just love how simple it is. In Colorflow 8 they pretty much added the Harmony method but I have not had time to mess with it. Making a massive screwup while fingerprinting a press would be a bad thing!
Kodak Prinergy
Preps 8
Epson 9800 and 9890
Screen 16000N
Screen R36000ZX
Kodak Insite for file submission and proofing

  • Joe
  • [*][*][*][*][*]
  • Administrator
  • Master of Nothing
Re: Harmony Issues and Recommendations
Reply #7
I do it slightly different from Joe but get the same result. We do not linearize, so my current is just 10=10, 20=20 etc and target is the number i get from Curve 3 when we run a fingerprint.

I need to start looking at Colorflow since Harmony is being phased out but I just love how simple it is. In Colorflow 8 they pretty much added the Harmony method but I have not had time to mess with it. Making a massive screwup while fingerprinting a press would be a bad thing!

It kind of sucks Kodak threw ColorFlow at us and you really need training to use it and the proper equipment also. Not to worry though Kodak will supply all of that...for a price!
Mac OS 10.12 Sierra | Prinergy 7.5 | Adobe Creative Cloud 2017 | Two Luscher XPose 160 CTP units

Prepress: One who does precision guess work based on unreliable data provided by those of questionable knowledge.

  • david
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  • Global Moderator
  • WTF?
Re: Harmony Issues and Recommendations
Reply #8
Colorflow is cool, but is a database hog.
We had maybe 2-3 snapshots (current and history) and they would tell is that is too many.

Prepress guy - doin' jobs one at a time

Re: Harmony Issues and Recommendations
Reply #9
Colorflow is cool, but is a database hog.
We had maybe 2-3 snapshots (current and history) and they would tell is that is too many.



Are you running Pro or just the basic version?
Kodak Prinergy
Preps 8
Epson 9800 and 9890
Screen 16000N
Screen R36000ZX
Kodak Insite for file submission and proofing

  • david
  • [*][*][*][*][*]
  • Global Moderator
  • WTF?
Re: Harmony Issues and Recommendations
Reply #10
We were using the pro...  until they closed the plant in January
Prepress guy - doin' jobs one at a time

Re: Harmony Issues and Recommendations
Reply #11
We were using the pro...  until they closed the plant in January

Thanks and sorry about your plant closing.
Kodak Prinergy
Preps 8
Epson 9800 and 9890
Screen 16000N
Screen R36000ZX
Kodak Insite for file submission and proofing