You should see it once you are logged into your ASN membership page. See attached.

Adobe has put up videos on all the new features of version 9.
This one is something that may come in handy.
http://www.adobe.com/designcenter/video_workshop/?id=vid0333

acro 9 just fixed a seriously messed up pdf with the examine and correct button.
only thing ive done with it so far tho!

Quote from: ninjaPB_43 on June 27, 2008, 09:02:02 AMHas anyone mentioned that the "Overprint Preview" is set for "Only for PDF/x files" as default?  I'm changing to "Always".  Hadn't even opened a document, I chose to go through the preferences first and noticed this, thought I'd mention it, and don't want to look and see if it's been mentioned yet..(lazy bum, I am)

Unless the ONLY documents that you view are prepress/publishing - and you NEVER view Word/Office, Scans, etc. - that's fine.  However, enabling Always WILL IMPACT YOUR PERFORMANCE on those non-publishing documents.  That's why it is NOT the default.

If you have an objection to "PDF/X only" - first, I'd like to understand why.  And second, use the "Automatic" option.  That will let Acrobat "do the right thing" in most cases.  for more info about these settings, see my blog at <http://www.acrobatusers.com/blogs/leonardr/2008/06/13/overprint-preview-it-just-works/>.

Leonard Rosenthol
PDF Standards Architect
Adobe Systems

Quote from: leonardr on August 06, 2008, 03:00:00 PM

Quote from: ninjaPB_43 on June 27, 2008, 09:02:02 AMHas anyone mentioned that the "Overprint Preview" is set for "Only for PDF/x files" as default?  I'm changing to "Always".  Hadn't even opened a document, I chose to go through the preferences first and noticed this, thought I'd mention it, and don't want to look and see if it's been mentioned yet..(lazy bum, I am)

Unless the ONLY documents that you view are prepress/publishing - and you NEVER view Word/Office, Scans, etc. - that's fine.  However, enabling Always WILL IMPACT YOUR PERFORMANCE on those non-publishing documents.  That's why it is NOT the default.

If you have an objection to "PDF/X only" - first, I'd like to understand why.  And second, use the "Automatic" option.  That will let Acrobat "do the right thing" in most cases.  for more info about these settings, see my blog at <http://www.acrobatusers.com/blogs/leonardr/2008/06/13/overprint-preview-it-just-works/>.

Leonard Rosenthol
PDF Standards Architect
Adobe Systems

Hi Leonard,

First...Welcome to the forums.

As far as the "Automatic" option, I tried it but I never receive PDF/X files so it's always turned off. Don't get me wrong I'd love to get PDF/X files but I have no customers capable of giving me one. At one time I tried getting some of them to output PDF/X-1a:2001 and you would have thought I kicked their puppy in the head. All the whining because it kept failing due to color, font, or image problems was enough to get me to abandon that idea. PDF/X make for some upfront planning and work in the native application and that's just to much to ask most people that only know that "it looks fine on my screen". Unfortunately this has what the world of printing has come to.

And my sweet kabobs...get rid of the toolbar on every PDF instead of ONE application toolbar. :wink:

Quote from: Joe on August 06, 2008, 05:52:44 PM

Quote from: leonardr on August 06, 2008, 03:00:00 PMIf you have an objection to "PDF/X only" - first, I'd like to understand why.  And second, use the "Automatic" option.  That will let Acrobat "do the right thing" in most cases.  for more info about these settings, see my blog at <http://www.acrobatusers.com/blogs/leonardr/2008/06/13/overprint-preview-it-just-works/>.

As far as the "Automatic" option, I tried it but I never receive PDF/X files so it's always turned off.

Automatic has nothing to do with PDF/X.   Instead, Acrobat examines the page content and if it sees that the page requires/uses overprinting then it turns on OPP - if it doesn't, then it leaves it off.   This is a fine option and one we had hoped to ship as the default.  However, as noted in my blog - there were too many false positives from a 3rd party that shall remain nameless .

Just don't use Always!

Quote from: Joe on August 06, 2008, 05:52:44 PMDon't get me wrong I'd love to get PDF/X files but I have no customers capable of giving me one. At one time I tried getting some of them to output PDF/X-1a:2001 and you would have thought I kicked their puppy in the head. All the whining because it kept failing due to color, font, or image problems was enough to get me to abandon that idea. PDF/X make for some upfront planning and work in the native application and that's just to much to ask most people that only know that "it looks fine on my screen". Unfortunately this has what the world of printing has come to.

What program(s) are your customers using for authoring and/or PDF creation?   Since the Adobe Creative Suite can directly produce PDF/X (and handle all the necessary color conversions, etc) and Acrobat can also create PDF/X from anything that prints - I don't see an issue here.   Maybe 5-10 years ago, sure.  but not now...

Quote from: Joe on August 06, 2008, 05:52:44 PMAnd my sweet kabobs...get rid of the toolbar on every PDF instead of ONE application toolbar. :wink:

Not going to happen - sorry. 

While I understand the "screen real-estate" argument (especially on the Mac, where vertical real-estate is almost non-existent - thanks a lot Steve!), the ability to have DIFFERENT toolbars on each document (you did know you could do that, right??) is more useful for our customers that work with different types of PDFs...

Leonard

Quote from: leonardr on August 06, 2008, 06:53:51 PM

Quote from: Joe on August 06, 2008, 05:52:44 PM

Quote from: leonardr on August 06, 2008, 03:00:00 PMIf you have an objection to "PDF/X only" - first, I'd like to understand why.  And second, use the "Automatic" option.  That will let Acrobat "do the right thing" in most cases.  for more info about these settings, see my blog at <http://www.acrobatusers.com/blogs/leonardr/2008/06/13/overprint-preview-it-just-works/>.

As far as the "Automatic" option, I tried it but I never receive PDF/X files so it's always turned off.

Automatic has nothing to do with PDF/X.   Instead, Acrobat examines the page content and if it sees that the page requires/uses overprinting then it turns on OPP - if it doesn't, then it leaves it off.   This is a fine option and one we had hoped to ship as the default.  However, as noted in my blog - there were too many false positives from a 3rd party that shall remain nameless .

Just don't use Always!

Well, I tried it and it was never on for any of my PDF's. (By my PDF's I mean customer supplied PDF's.) I deal with PDF's for print almost exclusively. I want it on ALWAYS.

Quote from: Joe on August 06, 2008, 05:52:44 PMDon't get me wrong I'd love to get PDF/X files but I have no customers capable of giving me one. At one time I tried getting some of them to output PDF/X-1a:2001 and you would have thought I kicked their puppy in the head. All the whining because it kept failing due to color, font, or image problems was enough to get me to abandon that idea. PDF/X make for some upfront planning and work in the native application and that's just to much to ask most people that only know that "it looks fine on my screen". Unfortunately this has what the world of printing has come to.

Quote from: leonardr on August 06, 2008, 06:53:51 PMWhat program(s) are your customers using for authoring and/or PDF creation?   Since the Adobe Creative Suite can directly produce PDF/X (and handle all the necessary color conversions, etc) and Acrobat can also create PDF/X from anything that prints - I don't see an issue here.   Maybe 5-10 years ago, sure.  but not now...

Yeah, that was probably about 5 years ago.

Quark, InDesign, PageMaker, Corel, Microsoft Office Apps including Publisher, AdPerfect PostScript Engine 1.25, Ghostscript, Distiller, Apple OS X, Page Plus, Print Artist Platinum...really any software that any basement designer can get their hands on. And yes, I know CS can handle the necessary color conversions but it needs to do them correctly. You can get some really ugly stuff if things are not checked closely and setup properly from the start. I have customers that make PDF's out of InDesign CS3 and never look at them. They take that PDF that they never look at and put it on our FTP site and they go home not even checking to make sure the file got to me, let alone whether the content of it is okay. To put it frankly I sometimes feel like I'm the Fred Sanford of printing. I deal in trashy files from people that don't know what they are doing and have no interest in putting in the effort to make better files. Like I said, this is what printing is today.

And by the way, which PDF/X should I use for commercial printing? (See attached image.)

Quote from: Joe on August 06, 2008, 05:52:44 PMAnd my sweet kabobs...get rid of the toolbar on every PDF instead of ONE application toolbar. :wink:

Quote from: leonardr on August 06, 2008, 06:53:51 PMNot going to happen - sorry. 

While I understand the "screen real-estate" argument (especially on the Mac, where vertical real-estate is almost non-existent - thanks a lot Steve!), the ability to have DIFFERENT toolbars on each document (you did know you could do that, right??) is more useful for our customers that work with different types of PDFs...

Leonard

My PDF's are disposable. I open them one time to preflight and barring problems that file is never opened again. Everything I do is for print. I want the same toolbar for every PDF there is. Why would I want a different toolbar for 92 different PDF's I'm working on right at the moment that will never be opened again? Again, Adobe should consider a version of Acrobat for the printing industry and throw out the fluff that we don't want. Heck, I would pay extra to get less sometimes.

Quote from: leonardr on August 06, 2008, 06:53:51 PMWhat program(s) are your customers using for authoring and/or PDF creation?   Since the Adobe Creative Suite can directly produce PDF/X (and handle all the necessary color conversions, etc) and Acrobat can also create PDF/X from anything that prints - I don't see an issue here.   Maybe 5-10 years ago, sure.  but not now...

Uhh... with all due respect, I'd love to get all my jobs from the creative suite where I know I can get a pretty reliable (barring operator error/ignorance) file, but the majority of work we get in the real world comes from anything and everything. If someone has a program loaded on their pc they can figure out how to send it to me and wonder why it's garbage. I get stuff designed in Power Point, Excel, Word Perfect, Print Shop Pro, MS Paint, etc. ad nauseum

Aside from that, I'm pretty much an Adobe fanboy and I'm pretty stoked you joined the forum. Just don't disappear when the heat gets too hot. Know what I mean?

Leonard, you have to understand where we are coming from... we are expert users of your software. We recommend its use to novice and pro. If they aren't using your products, we convince them it is better. In a lot of ways... your company owes some of its success to the Prepress people. We are your unsung salespeople and we take the brunt of tech support from real world users that can't get through or even understand your tech support... When they get fed up, they come to us.

Then when we make suggestions, or ask questions, we are put off or simply ignored. Understand, we love your software, hell, I love your software, but when that very software company starts heading in the way of Quark, I start wondering if you even care. You used to.

This is not directed at you personally Leonard, I respect the fact you have come here to answer some of our questions and share your knowledge. It's just, we have been crying for your companies help for a long time, and unfortunately, YOU as a representative of that company are going to get to hear it.

Please humor us, and be patient. We do appreciate what Adobe is and what it has done for the printing world. It could be sooooo much better, let us help you.

Thanks for listening.

DCS

Quote from: leonardrNot going to happen - sorry. 

the ability to have DIFFERENT toolbars on each document (you did know you could do that, right??) is more useful for our customers that work with different types of PDFs...

Leonard

I don't have different types of pdf. Different types of prepress pdfs perhaps x1 etc.

Ideally a preference to have a universal tool bar would be ideal, but pretty difficult to code I know. Or how about an option to switch off tool bars and have pallets and a pallet well? Or an option for a tool box down the side of the screen?

A choice would be nice. Right now the interface is getting a little top heavy and awkward.


Edit for a typo

Quote from: jezza  link=topic=1908.msg37058#msg37058 date=1218089416

Quote from: leonardrNot going to happen - sorry. 

the ability to have DIFFERENT toolbars on each document (you did know you could do that, right??) is more useful for our customers that work with different types of PDFs...

Leonard

I don't have different types of pdf. Different types of prepress pdfs perhaps x1 etc.

Ideally a preference to have a universal tool bar would be ideal, but pretty difficult to code I know. Or how about an option to switch off tool bars and have pallets and a pallet well? Or an option for a tool box down the side of the screen?

A choice would be nice. Right now the interface is getting a little top heavy and awkward.


Edit for a typo

Exactly. A choice would be wonderful. They had the universal toolbar in Acrobat 7 so I don't think it's all that difficult to code. Make the toolbar for each document the default if you want but give me a choice in preferences to change it so I can work the way I am comfortable working. Another thing that might help is to incorporate the Output Preview into the document window so it's not a separate window.

Let me echo some sentiments of others Leonard. We're thrilled to have you over here. Don't let our zest for prepress and the software we use scare you off.

Another thing I'd like to add about the toolbars. I set my toolbars up for the way I work. I want them to be in the exact same spot for every PDF I open. In fact, if someone uses my computer and changes my toolbars they better be ready to fight when I find out out who did it. :laugh:

The UI of Acrobat 8 & 9 are both clunky and inefficient. To move from Output Preview, to the toolbar, to a Pitstop Window, to any other window is an exercise in futility when many times you have to click once to give the window you want to use the focus and then click again to select what you were actually going for. What makes it even worse is it's not consistent. Sometimes one click will do it. Sometimes it takes two. I'm not complaining about this stuff just to complain, I'd really like to see it improved upon. In our job speed is the key. I preflight anywhere from 100 to 600 pages a shift. I probably look at most pages less than 10 seconds. I don't have time to even use Acrobats built in preflight. It just takes too long so I do it all visually. I sure as heck don't have time to reposition the toolbar for each document I open. I don't want to take that option away from your other customers but just want to have the choice to do it the way I want.

Quote from: leonardr on August 06, 2008, 06:53:51 PMAutomatic has nothing to do with PDF/X.   Instead, Acrobat examines the page content and if it sees that the page requires/uses overprinting then it turns on OPP - if it doesn't, then it leaves it off.   This is a fine option and one we had hoped to ship as the default.  However, as noted in my blog - there were too many false positives from a 3rd party that shall remain nameless .

Just don't use Always!

Leonard

Just re-read this and I'm a little confused. So don't use "Always"? If I put it on "Only for PDF/X files" it is going to be useless since I don't get any PDF/X files? And if I use "Automatic" I'm going to get many false positives? That only leaves me with "Never" and I'm not liking that option. I'm still finding the best option is to manually turn it on and off depending on the job type I'm working on by changing it from "Always" to "Never" only now I have to go into application preferences to do it instead of having it right in front of me in a menu. This seems like another case of Adobe deciding how I should work instead of listening to me about how I need to work to get the job done in the most efficient manner. Plus Adobe is assuming the files I get are correct. If I could count on them being correct I wouldn't need Overprint Preview in the first place.

And helpful info on Acrobat 9 and destructive cropping

Nice blog Leonard. I'll be checking it out regularly.

Quote from: Joe on August 07, 2008, 03:15:09 AM

Quote from: leonardr on August 06, 2008, 06:53:51 PMJust don't use Always!

Just re-read this and I'm a little confused. So don't use "Always"?

I'm still finding the best option is to manually turn it on and off depending on the job type I'm working on by changing it from "Always" to "Never" only now I have to go into application preferences to do it instead of having it right in front of me in a menu. This seems like another case of Adobe deciding how I should work instead of listening to me about how I need to work to get the job done in the most efficient manner. Plus Adobe is assuming the files I get are correct. If I could count on them being correct I wouldn't need Overprint Preview in the first place.

IF you are ONLY (or predominately) getting files destined for print - and you don't read other types of PDFs (ebooks, articles, etc.) - then you could use Always and be just fine.  The problem, as noted, is that Always will slow down rendering of non-print content.  If you're OK with that or you don't have that type of content - set it to Always.   

Automatic's "false positives" will never be wrong - we will ALWAYS turn on OPP when required.  It just sometimes we turn it on, and don't need to. 

Quote from: Joe on August 06, 2008, 05:52:44 PMMy PDF's are disposable. I open them one time to preflight and barring problems that file is never opened again. Everything I do is for print. I want the same toolbar for every PDF there is. Why would I want a different toolbar for 92 different PDF's I'm working on right at the moment that will never be opened again? Again, Adobe should consider a version of Acrobat for the printing industry and throw out the fluff that we don't want. Heck, I would pay extra to get less sometimes.

While I don't see us ever producing an "Acrobat for Print Production" (even if I personally think it's a good idea!) - we are indeed finding that we need to provide more tools to enable users to customize the environment (ala workspaces and such in CS).  Don't know what will be the end result - but it's certainly an ongoing discussion...

Leonard
(and don't worry - I've been doing online forums for 20+ years, you can't scare me .