Need A Little Input...

[DigitalCrapShoveler]

Okay, so I got this guy that comes in once a month, cool dude. He publishes a local magazine that appeals to college kids. Kind of a "what's hip" on the college scene bullshit. Anyhoo, the guy is using a freelancer that is okay, but makes some pretty sloppy mistakes. After a few months, I finally got this nitwit Desinger doing things by the book. The last few issues have been pretty breezy... then the publisher dude calls me.

"Hey man, I was wondering? I just got a new MacBook Pro, with all the bells and whistles. I bought the Adobe Premium Creative Suite 4, and I need you to hook me up."

I ask him does he need me to install software, give him some tips, I'm clueless here man, what do you want from me?

"I need you to completely train me to create my magazine, I mean all of it, Macs, Prepress, all the Adobe shit, ALL OF IT. I trust you and if you will do it, I would be honored. Oh, and I'll pay you."

Normally, I would not do it. I am not one that likes giving away all my secrets and knowledge that took me almost two decades to amass, but, I need the cash, so I'm selling out.

The guy wants to meet twice a week for a few hours. I do freelance and have a pay scale I use, but teaching is something I normally only do in a work environment. I am not concerned if I can do it, I just want to be fair.

What should I charge PER hour? I'm going to do it regardless, but if you had to do it, what would be the very lowest you would go, AND then what's fair?

So 2 prices here, get it?

As always, I am in your debt.

P.S. The guy is legit and NOT a homosexual.

[gnubler]

Well, first of all - WHY CAN'T HE TEACH HIMSELF?? Shit, most of us did. Does he not want to buy a few manuals and just jump in?

Second, do you think he'll "get it"? Is he capable and truly willing to learn. I guess he is if you accepted the offer. Do you get along with him ok?

I'd charge $25 an hour. You just get to sit there for a few hours and tell him what to do, what not to do. Maybe he'll throw in some free beer, too.

I'm also going to be training someone to use InDesign here pretty soon, but I'm trading out for food, not cash. "Will do it in Adobe for food"  :laugh: (It's for a local grocery I volunteer with)

[ninjaPB_43]

You can give a man a fishing pole, and yet you will not be able to teach the man to most effectively pull the lure. It takes practice. 

 

[gnubler]

Yeah. I mean, he'd be better off hitting the books himself, just jumping in and learning it himself. He can keep a list of things that he has questions about or is struggling with and then go over that with you. There's so many free tutes online...I think even the Adobe install disks have some sort of Beginner's Tutorial, no?

[DigitalCrapShoveler]

The guy is clueless, which means he is not tainted by actual schooling. I think it will be gravy. He is doing a swimsuit edition in 2 months. Featuring the models he uses in his magazine. I almost chew my own tongue off when I think about it. I offered my services as "oil boy," so we'll see if that pans out. :evil:

That is true BTW. Okay, so the guy is not as motivated as you or even PB, but if the guy wants to throw cash my way, does it really matter? I sit there like Gnub said and give him shit to do and joke about my pantless proofing days... no problem. $25 seems a wee bit on the low side, but I suppose I would do it. I am a whore.

[ninjaPB_43]

The guy is clueless, which means he is not tainted by actual schooling. I think it will be gravy. He is doing a swimsuit edition in 2 months. Featuring the models he uses in his magazine. I almost chew my own tongue off when I think about it. I offered my services as "oil boy," so we'll see if that pans out. :evil:

That is true BTW. Okay, so the guy is not as motivated as you or even PB, but if the guy wants to throw cash my way, does it really matter? I sit there like Gnub said and give him shit to do and joke about my pantless proofing days... no problem. $25 seems a wee bit on the low side, but I suppose I would do it. I am a whore.

I would think that to be on the low end too, but really depends on the market. LA would not be same as North Dakota.

[DigitalCrapShoveler]

Yes, I agree. Would what I make in OT be asking too little/too much? I would do it for work?

[gnubler]

I guess only you knows what you (and your time) is worth. Essentially what you're doing is tutoring. Maybe take a peek on craigslist or something and see what other tutors are charging for 1-on-1 sessions.

To me, $25/hr is high. But I'm pretty cheap and I live in a ghetto and don't have any bills.

[delooch]

it seems like it would be an experience, and if the dude seems worthy and you think he'll actually learn, why not? on the low end id charge $30/hr, (basing it on its on top of my 40+ hour work week, so i should be making time and a half min.), on the upper maybe $40-50. I try to get $50 an hour for design work- i dont enjoy designing for others so it should be worth my while.

[Joe]

$25 an hour is way too low. I wouldn't even consider anything less than $45 - $50 per hour. The main thing for me is that you are going to be doing it in your "away from your real job" hours. I value my away time and would need around double time. What would it cost him to take classes at the local juco and not get near the quality of information that he would get with you? You've worked hard for your knowledge and used a lot of your personal time to learn this shit. I know you did. All good prepress people did. So don't go giving it away. If he thinks that is too much he can hit the road.

[frailer]

Here's a compromise, from someone who's been on a steep curve in the past 2 years. Tell the guy it's gonna be an ongoing process; it'll take time; (years?), before he gets good enough to output stuff that will pass muster. Depending on his aptitude/inclination, of course.

It'll be painful for you doing this; has that whiff from your description. Tell him you'll give him 2x1 hour sessions to get him in at the basic level...like basic. Suggest he sign up with lynda.com. Or at the very least, the free Adobe online Flash tutes, which are really good, and repurposed from lynda.com anyway. Get him to go through a set number to a certain level; then suggest he book you for another 2x1 hours to consolidate,
Reassess from there.

And for your services; I'm with Joe....$50 /hour min. US$, not OzPesos.    :laugh:


...there's always prepresstraining.com; the advantage with them is they have an interactive setup, where you click on stuff, under instruction, before you can move on to the next step. It's a better reinforcer than straight-up viewing; but both types are good.
That stuff is big bang-for-buck, IMO. I got up and running in DynaStrip with PPT. No mean feat.    :evil:

But also it's not just pp stuff on PPT. There's general Adobe stuff, from novice up. Better that nice bloke with the Wisconsin accent telling him to "Now click on the Direct Select Tool"...than you doing that stuff.
That'd be crazy... for him and you.       About $300 for access to the full Library. 24/7; whenever the mood strikes. And make sure he subscribes to InDesign Magazine.

...er shit, that's not a little input, that's a lot.  I'll shaddup now.    :azn:

[agent_orange]

i used to give guitar lessons for walking around money at $30 a lesson (half hour). maybe you can use examples like that as proof of going rates and ask for $50 (or whatever) an hour. you can always negotiate  down but you might as well shoot for the moon. using the guitar analogy again, i would stress the amount of time you have in service and let him know it won't happen overnight. plus, tell him what it would cost if he did it himself, submitted it to your shop and they charged him for your time to fix all his rookie mistakes. those lessons would start looking really economical...

[DigitalCrapShoveler]

All pretty common sense solutions. Thank you all for your highly valued input. I do feel more confident going into this with your advice in pocket. My deepest appreciation.

I meet tomorrow with him for our first lesson. Wish me luck.

[gnubler]

Good luck. Like agent_orange said, this is a tutelage session(s). Check out your area and see what is common-price. I see that my suggestion of $25/hr was laughable based on the comments, but not all cities/regions/countries are the same. Where I live, getting paid $25/hr for anything is a stretch and an anomaly, no matter what your skills. I trust you - you wouldn't be wasting your time if this was a suspected "refusal to learn" scenario. If you actually are paid cash money, consider it beer money.

[DigitalCrapShoveler]

This guy may have a shot. Pretty bright kid. We spent 4 hours today learning a lot of shit, and never touched the computer. This guy is eating it up. Already he has absorbed more than I would have thought possible. I went back even, and tried to stump him... he has an excellent memory and ability to recall.

So far we have discussed file formats, color modes, DPI settings and color gamut. His homework is to familiarize himself thoroughly with the Pen Tool. I told him to save his work and e-mail me on Tuesday. We meet again Thursday night.

I took all the advice given, and merged it with my own. I came up with a figure of $250 for 2 lessons. One on Sundays for 4 hours and another in the week for 2. A total of 6 hours. I thank you all for your advice, once I had the information, I stood firm and presented my case. He was more than appreciative and thought the figure was very fair.