We have instances where I need the Front Surface of Sheet 1 to print and the Back Surface of Sheet 2 to print. We go to the Page Mapping and "Insert Blank Pages" (2 of them in this instance) and get everything moved around where it should be (PDF pages mapped to 1 & 4). When we go to render our plates there is an error message saying the surface is blank and the rendering process errors out and won't let us output the plates from the surfaces we need to. It seems like half the time this works with no problem and then there are days where it gives us fits. Does it have anything to do with certain jobs being spot color only? They seem to fail more than jobs that actually have black in them as a color. A lot of the people I'm trying to train on this system are becoming fairly frustrated with this. Anybody know what I'm doing wrong in this scenario?
I use blank pages all the time. Make sure you turn the blank pages on (active) after adding them. I usually just add them and activate them in the Job Structure mode, as opposed to Mapping mode. They come in as inactive by default.
By active do you mean the little green arrow pointing towards your plates? If so, they are. Still fails.
Weird. I just tried a mock job this way and it worked fine for me.
.... re-reading your post, you say the error is "surface is blank", which would indicate the entire plate surface is blank, meaning there is nothing to render. This makes sense. LOL
I just tried it this way and it did give me an error.
I usually add blank pages but still have active pages on a surface. Have never tried to render an entire surface as blank.
Why would you need to make plates that are blank?
I'm not making "blank plates". In some instances, I only need the back surface to have plates made on it. There has to be a blank page as a placeholder on the front surface. For instance, let's say the front of the form has a bunch of printing at the top. I need it to move down to get it inbetween our bends. The backer has printing more towards the bottom so it needs to move up to be between our bends. I have to make 2 Sheets due to this. The one for the face is easy enough since I can make that sheet Flatwork, but for the sheet that has the backer I need to have a blank area on the face surface. This is where I'm running into the problem. I've found a little bit of a work around, but it's not something I want to have to do on every job where this occurs.
The web world must be a totally different animal than sheetfed. :o
We have webs here. Not really sure what he means. We don't have to do anything like what he has explained with our webs.
nor do we, and we've had web presses for years.
Alright. Maybe I'm just a moron. I've attached screen shots about what I'm trying to explain. On Sheet 1 I have to "split the gap" on the face. So the backer and the face aren't on the same sheet. So Sheet 2 has a Blank Page for the face and then the backer PDF (And yes, I realize I could split the back too but our pressmen don't want us to split things if we don't have to). If I'm going about this all wrong, then by all means enlighten me. I'm not an Impo guru which is apparently obvious. I just kind of got thrown into this position of having to get this new workflow going. All help is appreciated.
No, you're not a moron, it's just we don't do our web runs like you do. That is not unusual in the printing biz. Somebody somewhere is doing the same stuff but doing it in a completely different way.
I notice your sheet is bigger than the plate (around the cylinder). Also, are you doing a half web?
It'll look like that when when splitting the gap. I have to add an extra image and adjust it to get inbetween our bends. And we just have our paper width set up at the max in our templates. Some jobs will be 1 across and others will be 2.
Quote from: david on January 26, 2015, 09:47:00 AMSomebody somewhere is doing the same stuff but doing it in a completely different way.
This is so true and I can rarely get it through the boss's head. I finally got him to stop making me impose stuff that's being printed elsewhere.
Quote from: Holsinger60 on January 23, 2015, 11:56:28 AMWe have instances where I need the Front Surface of Sheet 1 to print and the Back Surface of Sheet 2 to print. We go to the Page Mapping and "Insert Blank Pages" (2 of them in this instance) and get everything moved around where it should be (PDF pages mapped to 1 & 4). When we go to render our plates there is an error message saying the surface is blank and the rendering process errors out and won't let us output the plates from the surfaces we need to. It seems like half the time this works with no problem and then there are days where it gives us fits. Does it have anything to do with certain jobs being spot color only? They seem to fail more than jobs that actually have black in them as a color. A lot of the people I'm trying to train on this system are becoming fairly frustrated with this. Anybody know what I'm doing wrong in this scenario?
You are getting the error because you have a blank page slot in 2 & 3. Every page slot must have a page assigned to it or you will get the error. If you insert a blank page in your reading order and assign it to pages 2 & 3 it will fix your problem. It has nothing to do with colour but XMF is telling you it is the lack of colour i.e.: a blank slot not assigned.
That's what's throwing me off though. I've got blank pages inserted into my Reading Order and they are pointing to the plates (which is what I'm assuming means they're assigned). It will still error out.
Sorry... late to this.
Any chance a screenshot of your Source Files/Reading Order/Job Structure columns so we can get a bird's eye...?
Here's a couple of screen shots of a job that fails.
Looks like surface 1 is entirely blank. It can't render nothing. I don't understand why you are trying to render nothing. ???
Yes. The surface for Sheet 1 Front is Blank. There is only printing on the Back surface. I inserted a "Blank Page" in my Reading Order as a placeholder. When I hit "Save", the error pops up saying there are Blank Surfaces (I've attached a Screen Shot). It tries to Render the Blank Pages along with the ones that actually have printing. I don't see where I can pick and choose what surfaces to Render at this point. Maybe I'm missing something. Again, I'm not trying to actually burn blank plates. I'm just trying to render the job so I can burn the plates I need. When it fails like this, it won't let me Release the Separations from the surfaces I'm actually trying to burn plates on. Maybe I'm missing something simple in the process, not explaining myself well enough for anyone to help or just don't have a fahqing clue what I'm doing.
I know what you're saying, just don't understand why you are even messing with sides that are entirely blank. There are other ways to impose that do not include trying to render blank sides. The problem is that you are trying to render nothing.
I would do it as 2 flat sheets instead of two sheetwise with 2 blank sides. The workflow is doing its job. I don't see the point in even trying to build a blank side, and the workflow obviously thinks this too. You're doing prepress wrong, man. Nothing personal but what you are trying to do makes no sense. Are you just building blank sides so the plates are labeled a certain way for the press? If that is the case, stop it and figure out a different way to label things, or tell the pressmen that you are doing it different.
XMF thinks page 2 and 3 are blank on a sheet wise job.
It thinks you don't need sheet wise.
can you make a template that puts something in the corner maybe?
We just got the 6.1.2 upgrade today, and a quick look at the fix list I noticed this "From users: When exporting jobs with blank pages, the Plate output fails"
Maybe I'm misunderstanding something here - but it still fails as before!
As some say, why would you want to render a blank plate? I guess you don't, but you don't want the job entering a state of FAILED either.
I know from experience that some of our jobs require some weird setups and job construction, and it can certainly be easier at times to leave a surface blank and not bastardizing the impo to flat work. (which is what we currently do)
My two cents.
We've just been throwing a custom mark in the corner of the blank page as suggested above and it seems to be a decent work around. It may not be the right way of doing things, but it makes it easier for everyone to keep straight what's what.