Imposition software, replacement for Preps

[DPSprint]

So I'm contemplating a change from preps, currently on 7 but I have had a few issues with some pdfs created out of preps (see other threads if interested) and given that its about $600 US to update to 8 and the issues will still remain I see very little point.
Not to mention the complete lack of technical help available for those of us who have the standalone version and are not using Prinergy. (Been told by the country supplier that unless you have a service contract with them they wont even answer emailed technical questions, thats kodak for ya).
We also now only have the smaller presses so dont often have the complicated impos we used to have with the A2.

I've pretty much decided that there might be better options out there to investigate... which is nice as that was never an option when we first started with preps, many years ago... well except dynostrip and that one sucked bigtime.
So i would like some opinions from the community... anyone out there using other options?

Imposition studio is one i am looking at... they have a really good fully functioning demo so I have been able to trial a few files and so far so good (i.e the issue I have out of preps does NOT happen!), cost is pretty low but i have no idea of support? (think I will email them and see how they respond to queries). I havent even found any forums for it but It looks like it will do the things I want from what I have looked at.

Imposititon Wizard: I have yet to look at that one.

Quite Imposing: I used this a few years ago but it was pretty clunky and I dont think it will do what I want... but I have not looked at the latest version so I dont really know.

I think I would prefer a standalone software rather than an acrobat plugin

so any ideas people?

[Slappy]

I was using Imposition Studio for just under a year, it was a reasonably priced stopgap until we committed to XMF, but it was far from ideal for our 4up press. Yes, it does templates & has some of the "big boy" features it was just overall cumbersome but it got things done & was miles above manually imposing everything in InDesign.

Case in point: I had to make special Actions in Pitstop to post-process its Imposed PDFs, as it was making the final sheet-sized files larger due to the side guides. Oh, and it wouldn't let me specify which edge was the gripper. It may be fine for digital work and small presses, and there's nothing else I found in the same price that had the features it does.

Support: I only emailed a few times, they were responsive but a little "Oh, we're planning that in an update" when I asked about features or fixes. Don't think I saw more than one update in the tie we used it.

[DPSprint]

thanks slappy!
How long ago did you use it? I think they have got a fairly recent update, on version 5 now
Was it the offset version you used?
Im still trying to get my head around how to put on side lays etc

[Tracy]

InDesign has an inexpensive imposition plug in maybe you can do a trial?
It works pretty good for Digital stuff, If that's what your doing.
One thing I don't like about it is it creates a pdf from the initial indesign file
I would rather use my orig pdf, so I relink to my orig.
I rarely use it, just for weird sizes if I'm in a hurry.

[DPSprint]

Most of my files are supplied as pdfs so I probably need a pdf imposition rather than indesign plugin.

Slappy: I see what you mean about creating a larger size when adding lay marks, thats a bit annoying!
This is gonna take a while to work through.. sigh...

[Ear]

PDF workflow is indispensable, for modern CTP prepress. Most of the good ones have built in imposition. The in-house impo in Sierra/XMF is very nice, and I'm an old Prep's junkie... haven't touched Preps in years.

[Joe]

She was using Preps. The problem is that Preps was never meant to output imposed PDF's. Proven by the problems she was having with her Preps generated PDF's. It is meant to output JDF to a workflow that then makes the imposed PDF.

[DPSprint]

funny enough, its fuji who have installed the new RIP this month, which is a vast improvement on the very old RIP... I did mention about XMF to the boss but I think it will be too expensive to get.
 
Joe: Im curious, have used preps of and on for many years through a few different versions... was it never intended as a imposed pdf output?

[Joe]

No. In Kodaks world you should output to Prinergy which sends JDF from Preps to Prinergy. And from my limited experience with XMF it worked fine to output JDF and then import that into XMF. At the time we were trying XMF they were having trouble creating some of our complicated multi-sig impositions in the XMF imposition software (not saying XMF won't do it today but our trainers didn't know how to do it at the time). Preps just doesn't have the know how or muscle to handle live transparency like a full blown workflow (Prinergy, XMF, etc...) using the Adobe PDF Print Engine.

Now you say you got a new RIP? Can it import JDF files? Either kind named with the .pjtf extension or a .jdf extension. If you can....try exporting a .pjtf from Preps and then import it into your RIP.

[Ear]

She was using Preps. The problem is that Preps was never meant to output imposed PDF's. Proven by the problems she was having with her Preps generated PDF's. It is meant to output JDF to a workflow that then makes the imposed PDF.

Right, that's why I'm saying an integrated workflow is the best. I export imposed PDFs from mine daily, in addition to the 1-bit tiffs.

I think Xitron Sierra is more affordable than XMF. They are not quite the same anymore and drift further apart, now that Xitron pwns Sierra. And the multi-sig part has come a long way. I had to bring Preps JDF templates into Sierra, back in the XMF days but the techs at Xitron updated it and I can now have all sorts of crazy multi-sig madness. And I use Sierra to prep for my digital press, because it is way better than trying to do it in the Fiery... export imposed PDF from Sierra to hotfolders, monitored by the Fiery.

[DPSprint]

will check that out Joe

[Joe]

Right, that's why I'm saying an integrated workflow is the best. I export imposed PDFs from mine daily, in addition to the 1-bit tiffs.

I think Xitron Sierra is more affordable than XMF. They are not quite the same anymore and drift further apart, now that Xitron pwns Sierra. And the multi-sig part has come a long way. I had to bring Preps JDF templates into Sierra, back in the XMF days but the techs at Xitron updated it and I can now have all sorts of crazy multi-sig madness. And I use Sierra to prep for my digital press, because it is way better than trying to do it in the Fiery... export imposed PDF from Sierra to hotfolders, monitored by the Fiery.

Yeah the problem is that her RIP isn't integrated with any kind of workflow. She is imposing PDF's and exporting an imposed PDF directly from Preps and Preps doesn't make the greatest PDF's. But if her new RIP can import JDF (.pjtf or .jdf files) she might be able to continue to use Preps.

[Joe]

will check that out Joe

What kind of RIP are you using now? Of course if it is an old one it probably won't do any better than Preps. 

[Ear]

And yes, Joe is right about JDF.

JDF can act a little funny, if you try to use too much automation, in my experience. They come in as a static mark template, with static page placement but they will keep the PDF live, separate of the template marks, until rendering. I think it will work but it might be limited or you will have to make position edits in Preps and update. 

I actually still have a bunch of old JDF templates in Sierra that my more limited staff prefers, because they can't really get themselves in trouble.

[Ear]

I haven't actually launched Preps in years, so I can't remember all of the nuances of JDF creation but there were a handful of parameters that would produce odd errors. I remember if I modified marks on a template, then exported, the resulting JDF would not allow pages to auto center. But if I modified the template, quit Preps - restart, then open and export without modifying, the template would be okay. 

I also remember a problem with Creep being intermittent, in the JDF. There were others that aren't coming to mind but most were just doing things in certain order. It was weird but I got a lot of work done that way, until I got integrated.