Author Topic: Proofing for uncoated stocks - suggestions?  (Read 952 times)

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Offline ninjaPB_43

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Proofing for uncoated stocks - suggestions?
« on: May 15, 2018, 12:20:20 PM »
I have a 1-time a year uncoated (70# uncoated text) job coming up and I want to have my internal proofs get close to my printer's proofs and press.

I currently run Gracol on a semi-matte for all of our proofs and we are matching our coated jobs (almost perfectly) at several G7 qualified printers.

What can I do internally to get out ahead of proofing for an uncoated job? 
People will notice the change in your attitude towards them, but won't notice their behavior that made you change.  -Bob Marley

Offline Ear

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Re: Proofing for uncoated stocks - suggestions?
« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2018, 12:45:26 PM »
Quote from: ninjaPB_43 link=msg=300514 date=1526401220

What can I do internally to get out ahead of proofing for an uncoated job?


Cry a little then swallow it b4 anyone sees you.  :hello:
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Offline ninjaPB_43

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Re: Proofing for uncoated stocks - suggestions?
« Reply #2 on: May 15, 2018, 12:52:20 PM »
Quote from: Ear link=msg=300516 date=1526402726

Cry a little then swallow it b4 anyone sees you.  :hello:


You mean like your mom did last night?  :ninja:


So, seriously though, is buying a roll of proofing stock like GMG's ProofPaper matte 140 my only option? Or is there a way to emulate uncoated on my semi-matte with good results?
People will notice the change in your attitude towards them, but won't notice their behavior that made you change.  -Bob Marley

Offline AaronH

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Re: Proofing for uncoated stocks - suggestions?
« Reply #3 on: May 15, 2018, 03:19:22 PM »
I've been trying to do something similar for about 3 years now. No real luck. Our color guy from Fuji suggested applying a cutback in our Oris software that runs our Epson 9900 but I spent a lot of time getting it to look okay and the sales team complained about the color not being as rich as it is on regular proofs.  ::)
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Offline Ear

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Re: Proofing for uncoated stocks - suggestions?
« Reply #4 on: May 15, 2018, 04:13:04 PM »
With sales, it helps to keep a proof and a newsprint press sheet nearby, as a quick reminder of the difference.
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Offline mc hristel

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Re: Proofing for uncoated stocks - suggestions?
« Reply #5 on: May 15, 2018, 06:30:45 PM »
If I remember correctly you are using an epson for color proofs.

You could try and get some samples of the actual stock the job is running on (cut down to 28x36 or whatever you can run through your proofer) and print proofs on that. You might need to cut back on the ink coverage a bit to reduce wrinkling but it should work fine. Back at a shop I used to work at we ran all our 2 sided proofs out using just our house uncoated stock and it worked fine.

Offline Slappy

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Re: Proofing for uncoated stocks - suggestions?
« Reply #6 on: May 15, 2018, 11:37:39 PM »
Quote from: ninjaPB_43 link=msg=300518 date=1526403140

Quote from: Ear link=msg=300516 date=1526402726

Cry a little then swallow it b4 anyone sees you.  :hello:


You mean like your mom did last night?  :ninja:


So, seriously though, is buying a roll of proofing stock like GMG's ProofPaper matte 140 my only option? Or is there a way to emulate uncoated on my semi-matte with good results?

Not sure how helpful this is, but our Fuji Trainer person setup an Uncoated Profile for our Epson to run on our typical semi-matte stock. I haven't "hard" tested it to see how close it matches but I've got a few uncoated jobs in the pipe already to run soon, I'll pull Epsons with that Profile and see how close it actually is though.

Side note: I don't honestly know because our plant manager doesn't always ask for Epsons, he’ll have the press guy(s) run to the numbers in many instances.
A little diddie ‘bout black 'n cyan...two reflective colors doin’ the best they can.

Offline ninjaPB_43

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Re: Proofing for uncoated stocks - suggestions?
« Reply #7 on: May 23, 2018, 06:41:03 PM »
UPDATE:

Here's where I'm going... 

I've setup a new "uncoated" workflow on my RIP using the GRACoL2013UNC_CRPC3.icc as a starting point.

I have a test file that we keep lying around that I sent to our G7 qualified vendor and had him run me a copy on the proofing paper they typically use for uncoated jobs. (ORIS E-OMP185) I will use this as my target.

I ordered a couple rolls of Epson's Enhanced Matte proofing paper (which ended up being no where near as white as the ORIS, but it'll get me close) - I ran the same test file, and it's close. I'm now going to use a Visual Correction at the RIP to pull some magenta out and dial in to the target proof from the printer.

Once I have that set - then our live jobs can proof/color correct through that uncoated workflow with confidence that it will get us really close to the printer's proof once we release files to them...

Trial and error - I know..  but I don't have all the correct measuring devices in house - and really don't need to get that technical when I have eyes that can get me just as close.   :ninja:
People will notice the change in your attitude towards them, but won't notice their behavior that made you change.  -Bob Marley

Offline AaronH

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Re: Proofing for uncoated stocks - suggestions?
« Reply #8 on: May 24, 2018, 01:14:40 PM »
Nice! If you don't mind me asking... Where did you find that uncoated profile? I can't seem to find one in our system.
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Offline ninjaPB_43

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Re: Proofing for uncoated stocks - suggestions?
« Reply #9 on: May 24, 2018, 02:10:22 PM »
Quote from: AaronH link=msg=300646 date=1527182080

Nice! If you don't mind me asking... Where did you find that uncoated profile? I can't seem to find one in our system.


It was stock in our Fiery XF.  Just went to New Workflow and it was one of the drop down options..
People will notice the change in your attitude towards them, but won't notice their behavior that made you change.  -Bob Marley

Offline AaronH

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Re: Proofing for uncoated stocks - suggestions?
« Reply #10 on: May 24, 2018, 03:13:31 PM »
Oh nice. For some reason our ORIS rip doesn't have a gracol uncoated profile anywhere. I downloaded a profile from gracol's site but for some reason I couldn't get ORIS to work with it. Oh well, my Fuji color guy is showing up soon for our G7 certification soon and we'll have him for another day of training on making profiles and such on ORIS.
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Offline ninjaPB_43

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Re: Proofing for uncoated stocks - suggestions?
« Reply #11 on: May 24, 2018, 06:01:39 PM »
Quote from: AaronH link=msg=300648 date=1527189211

Oh nice. For some reason our ORIS rip doesn't have a gracol uncoated profile anywhere. I downloaded a profile from gracol's site but for some reason I couldn't get ORIS to work with it. Oh well, my Fuji color guy is showing up soon for our G7 certification soon and we'll have him for another day of training on making profiles and such on ORIS.


Nice! I would think the ORIS RIP would handle using the profile just fine - kinda weird. Maybe it just needs to be in a correct folder somewhere for the drop down to see it.

On another note - I'm not having much luck with it. I changed the proofer over to matte black inks, I've tried printing blacks as inkjet, I've tried numerous iterations of target rendering - and am not very happy with the results. I'm going to sleep on it and give it another go tomorrow. My trial & error is up to about 10 errors now.  :banghead:

:ninja:

EDIT: FYI, I WILL make that proofer my bitch one way or another.   :rotf: :ninja:
People will notice the change in your attitude towards them, but won't notice their behavior that made you change.  -Bob Marley

Offline david

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Re: Proofing for uncoated stocks - suggestions?
« Reply #12 on: May 25, 2018, 09:26:21 AM »
you go girl!!!

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