Fair wage

[Adriano]

I would like to compare my wages with others pre-press operators
It has been done before (see topic below) but one year has passed by and things have changed!

https://www.b4print.com/forums/index.php?topic=61.0

My weekly net pay (and I say net because different countries have different tax rates) is $744AUD (Australian Dollars)
Live rates at 2008.09.14
744.00 AUD = 607.719 USD

I get paid overtime but it is now very rare
20 years in pre-press and 49 years of age
Am I, in your opinion, getting a fair wage?
I am considering the cleaning business
Any opinion is welcome
Thank you

[Joe]

Seems kind of low to me but I have no idea on what the job market is like in Australia. Here in the midwest USA that would be on the very bottom rung of the payscale for someone with your experience.

[Adriano]

Seems kind of low to me but I have no idea on what the job market is like in Australia. Here in the midwest USA that would be on the very bottom rung of the payscale for someone with your experience.

Thank you Joe
I might emigrate to the USA
(Not really, I love Australia)

I am just very frustrate about not getting the fair money I truly deserve for the hard work I do

[frailer]

A bit hard to answer, adriano. I must say, there do seem to be fewer and fewer prepress jobs in the classifieds here in the East. And even on net-based employment sites it's hard to really get a handle on what they expect; they're couched in such bullshit jargon...you know the usual language..."must exhibit superior skills in...blah blah". You really wouldn't know until you fronted for an interview.

Reason I'm saying this is that you're, in theory, located in a so-called "boom state". Am wondering if the general skills shortage there may have trickled down to prepress. As in, prepress people off to the Kimberley for the big bucks, leaving warm prepress seats? Only you can check that out there. My imagination says you may be able to exploit that a bit, or at least have a look around to see what's on offer.

The ball-park figure a PP manager I know waved at me about a year ago was: $45K to nudging $60K, [gross/before tax], ranging from newbie to your sort of experience. That's Eastern cap. cities. If you have the time, maybe do some searches on the net/employment. But prepress jobs/money seems to be a hard one to pin down. The industry's still changing so quickly.

It's been discussed here in other threads, but there's a general feeling of "de-skilling" in the air. Automated/pre-flighted/fixed PDFs being the main threat/change. Learning new web-based skills, or branching into other related areas may be an option.

[Adriano]

Thank you frailer
I hear you!
In Perth we are playing the musical chairs for prepress operator position.
When somebody leaves a printshop, everybody moves a step higher in the ladder
The demand for skilled operators is high but the pay is bloody low.
Nobody else applies for a job like this and we have people from the UK filling in.
Everybody is up North doing everything else for triple the pay
My question is, why such a skilled and rare to fill position is so horribly paid?
If I leave my job I am sure that my employeer will have serious trouble to replace me!
If I want a payrise I have to tell the Boss I am leaving and voila, the payrise (pityfull) arrives.
Why?
The printing is booming and the jobs coming in are less and less close to be printed professionally.
Client are mainly secretary with no graphics experience who have acces to Indesign (day by day cheaper to buy). RGB and True Type Fonts are everyday bread and if you get a folder or a gate folded pamphlet, whow, guess who is fixing all this #@$$!
ME at 9 o'clock at night!
I hate this situation because I love my job
JOE: probably you should move this topic to rants
Sorry
 

[frailer]

Well, it's a situation a lot in PP are facing; not really a Rant, methinks. I'm inclined to leave it here...

Yep, that's crazy, right? You gotta threaten to leave before you get attention. Well, you might have to call their bluff at some stage, mate, seems to me. And no offence to our UK cousins, but even a skilled backpacker is no real solution, just a finger in the dyke for a while.
I feel your dilemma.    :sad:

[Adriano]

Thank you frailer
It feels good relieve yourself among friends who know what you are going through
Thank you
 

[gnubler]

Lots of circumstances involved in this - regional economics, family status, personal goals, and such... Of course, I can only speak of living in the US, where things are relatively inexpensive outside of big market metros like NYC and LA, etc.

Personally, if I were making 607.71 a week it would be a small fortune. DINK household, renting, no debt...it's a small fortune. Of course, this doesn't match everyone's scenario. In the early 2000s I was earning roughly that amount, and in a different family situation, and I will admit it was tight. I had to simplify my life, big time.

Also depends on the work you do and how happy you are with the job. For example, three years ago I was hired at a small printshop as a "prepress manager", but in reality it was a one-squirrel show and within months I was back doing bindery, answering phones, and writing up job tickets - in addition to all the prepress junk - and I felt the wage didn't justify me doing the jobs of 3 people. I quit.

Also depends on what sort of lifestyle you choose to live. I'm on the super low-end of amenities and am quite content on a lower salary. Last year I was making $17/hr working at a digital shop, but honestly I felt guilty because I really didn't need the extra money. (BTW, it's all long gone. Beer and other non-tangibles, you know.)

Presently, I'm not working directly in prepress and I live in a ghetto near the Mexican border, so I don't really have a valid answer to put in regarding this topic.

[Adriano]

Thank you gnubler
I agree with you
I can survive quite well together with my wife wage
But this is not the point
I know I deserve better and I give all I got for little reward
At this point I am considering really doing cleaning in offices where the money are the same but where I can sleep without thinking at the job I left behind
Thank you

[gnubler]

Wow, I didn't realize cleaning offices in Australia was so lucrative. In the US, it's mostly retards and convicted felons doing it for less than minimum wage (around $7/hr, depends on the state). Correct me if I'm wrong.

[Adriano]

I could get $25.00 an hour in the city and up to $80.000 in northern places (mining) lodging included. It is very hard to find people working trades after the mining industry here is booming. Plumbers get more than dentists! This is what makes me angry.
Everybody is making more money than I!
And prices are got up to the roof
$5.00 AUS a kilo of potatoes
That is ridicolous

[frailer]

And prices are got up to the roof

That is the twist to this boom state resources madness. If you're not on the inflated wage bandwagon, you're going backwards because that is driving prices upwards. They're saying that China/India will be sucking coal/iron ore outa WA & QLD for the next 8 years at least before the demand starts to slip. Hate to say it adriano, but you've got some options to consider there, whether you like it or not. Just continuing to live and work in WA will force it upon you somewhat.
Got a feeling you'll work out a solution within the next 6 months though.   :cool:   Just a feeling...cos you're obviously getting restless about it; the precursor to some action.    :wink:

[Chilbear]

"... Plumbers get more than dentists! ...

I hear your frustration. I asked plumber this question and he said (in CDN dollars) I charge $75 per hour to install plumbing to let you take a s**t and $150 per hour to fix the pipes that are filled with it. Plumbing is a messy business. Kind of comparing an apple to an orange, or a designer to a prepress expert.

Your rate may be low and I feel that is true were I am. I suggest you give us relative things we can compare as a basis. Things like gas price, electricity price, annual property tax on your house - things we all have to pay and these are unique to your locale. Competition factors in very large - so the remote miming camp idea makes sense but would you do it at 49? I am older (a few more years) and I am encouraging my kids to think this way and we would follow them in a support way if necessary. Easy call at 25 and not so at 50.

[LoganBlade]

I could get $25.00 an hour in the city and up to $80.000 in northern places (mining) lodging included. It is very hard to find people working trades after the mining industry here is booming. Plumbers get more than dentists! This is what makes me angry.
Everybody is making more money than I!
And prices are got up to the roof
$5.00 AUS a kilo of potatoes
That is ridiculous

A side note on the Plumber Dentist. Plumber working for a company might make $20 to $25 and the company gets the $50+ and like a dentist he could... wait for it... own the company and charge what he wants to make a living. Prepress relies on a company and at the whim of an owner. and as long as kids know how to use a computer they will take jobs at lower pay to get a job and then lower the pay of others doing the same work.

I might try doing design, have the paper that says I am and then I could charge what ever I want and prepress would like me because the job goes in correct and prints. Love the job but hate the industry. So many retards getting better pay and having less than a quarter of the skills. The more you know the more they seem to screw you.

[Adriano]

Thank you everybody
Frailer is right
I shouldn't blame the wage but the economy
Western Australia is too expensive
It used to be the cheapest place in Australia and now is the most expensive
I used to make a good living when I was younger and now I get paid less (proportionally)
Thank you all for the input
Problem is that I love what I do and I only do what I love
I am probably the cause of all my trouble
I will have to find a solution outside the square I am living in
Cheers