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Number of Colors

Started by Bakamoo, May 05, 2014, 09:36:41 PM

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Bakamoo

Hello,

I'm a total newbie to printing and hoping that you guys could help. I'm a client and not the printer, so if you explain it via what I would know, it'll be extremely helpful. I cannot ask the printer directly since I am passing through another company who's only reply was your designer should know it, which they also don't.

According to the printer, our design has 11 colors and they can only do 8 or 9. We need to print this on a foil.  After doing a bit of research, I found only 5 colors for printing which are in CMY, White and Black.

Is there a way to convert our 11 colors to 8 or 9? Hope someone could help. Even better if there is an explanation for 2 colors, 4 colors, 8, 9, 11 and other common numbers. Thanks!

Attached a sample below. It is in jpg but the printer has the ai format.

Diddler

Quote from: Bakamoo on May 05, 2014, 09:36:41 PMHello,

I'm a total newbie to printing and hoping that you guys could help. I'm a client and not the printer, so if you explain it via what I would know, it'll be extremely helpful. I cannot ask the printer directly since I am passing through another company who's only reply was your designer should know it, which they also don't.

According to the printer, our design has 11 colors and they can only do 8 or 9. We need to print this on a foil.  After doing a bit of research, I found only 5 colors for printing which are in CMY, White and Black.

Is there a way to convert our 11 colors to 8 or 9? Hope someone could help. Even better if there is an explanation for 2 colors, 4 colors, 8, 9, 11 and other common numbers. Thanks!

Attached a sample below. It is in jpg but the printer has the ai format.
Hi Bakamoo and welcome,

Firstly I would go to the printer and ask how the job has been quoted to print, it could be as process colours or quoted to have special PMS colours? I would then politely ask if they can also adjust the artwork to suit the way they want to print or how it's been quoted. Obviously this will incur a $ charge but will give you the best result when printed.

If all that fails your going to need a designer who knows about the way that the file is intend to print.
I look forward to some of the responses . . . .
You can't polish a Turd, but you can roll it in glitter!

frailer

Hmmm, seems he can't ask the printer. The guy in the middle is being a smart-arse, by the sounds, and less than helpful.
Bakamoo, maybe you're in uncharted waters here. Who wrote the job spec for it? Is it for process colours only? What is the printing process; is it offset? Onto signage via silkscreen? Stuff like that if you could fill us in.
If your designer did not get a decent job spec up-front, then nasty shoals await your ship. Sounds like there are a number of Spot colours in the job that have to be (partially?) converted to Process Colours.  :undecided: But guessing from here...
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Bakamoo

Yup the middle man is a smart ass, replying with "!"... but I do understand them since they dont speak english as a native language.

We'll be printing around 1million pieces of the attached file so I'm thinking it's rotogravure? It's the one i usually see in China anyway. As for spot or process, whichever is the cheaper option will be the one they'd go for. Based on the pic, it seems like process?

I am trying to get the printer/middleman to adjust the artwork for me for 2 weeks now. Still waiting for an OK. Additional cost is ok for me, but waiting for that OK.

As for jobspec, we just asked our designer to design and yes they did know what we would do with the image. But they have no idea about the type of printing. When I asked them about the 8-9 and 11 and they don't know.

Are there any third party company I can outsource the conversion job to? Not sure what my keyword will be.

Thanks!


Bakamoo

Oh yeah and they previously said per cylinder color is 1500-2000 usd

David

Looks like you are working on a packaging file, I assume the white is an undercolor (under the cmyk but on top if the foil paper),
easy answer for converting colors in Illustrator...

Select All
Edit > Edit Colors > Convert to CMYK

Simplified method of adding white:
duplicate the shapes you want to have white on another layer, make a new swatch called "white", add the white to whatever areas you need, and you may need to pinch or pullback the white objects for registration purposes and make sure it is set to overprint.
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frailer

I'm glad I won't work in packaging in this lifetime.
Forgotten good guys: Dennis Ritchie, Burrell Smith, Bill Atkinson, Richard Stallman
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Now just an honorary member.

Joe

Quote from: frailer on May 06, 2014, 08:50:24 PMI'm glad I won't work in packaging in this lifetime.

Maybe in the next one though? :laugh:
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Bakamoo

Haha thanks for the messages guys and to those the pm'ed me. Guess theres really no choice, will ask for the printer to meet us if they can't do it via email. Really want to make things slower and more difficult...

This should be one of the things learned in school. Most businesses will have packaging/design 1 way or the other. Everyone should learn this as basic.

Bakamoo

Good example of the 4 colors (CMYK) is

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=EVrCvocyC2o
from https://www.b4print.com/index.php?topic=6769.0

It lacks the white which makes it 5. Just dont understand how it reached the 8-9 or 11 colors. Will just have to wait for the meeting :)

Farabomb

My record for spot colors in a job was 25+.

Never underestimate the power of idiots designers to royally screw something up.
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My other job

StudioMonkey

Quote from: Bakamoo on May 05, 2014, 10:44:58 PMAs for jobspec, we just asked our designer to design and yes they did know what we would do with the image. But they have no idea about the type of printing.  When I asked them about the 8-9 and 11 and they don't know.

The designer SHOULD know where the spot colours are used - they put the artwork together.  They should be able to fix this.  Anyone with the right version of Illustrator could find the spot colours and amend to give you 8 or 9 separations.  My guess would be the logo has 3 spots; red, grey and brown.  This plus CMYK and White gives you 8 colours.
Time flies like an arrow - fruit flies like a banana

Bakamoo

I thought grey came from black? What about the gradient in the red (our red shade towards darker red)? Is this a mixture of red and black? Thanks guys! I know where to remove some colors now. Going to aim for 8 colors.

StudioMonkey

I was assuming the logo has at least some of the spot colours in the job.  I don't really know without seeing the Illustrator file.

Grey usually come from black but y'know, its a logo.  The gradient in the red has to be either solid to tint (doesn't look like that) or red + grey overprint.  Last I heard you can't do a gradient with spot colours.
Time flies like an arrow - fruit flies like a banana

andyfest

Quote from: StudioMonkey on May 09, 2014, 03:32:35 AMI was assuming the logo has at least some of the spot colours in the job.  I don't really know without seeing the Illustrator file.

Grey usually come from black but y'know, its a logo.  The gradient in the red has to be either solid to tint (doesn't look like that) or red + grey overprint.  Last I heard you can't do a gradient with spot colours.
You can do spot to spot grads now - I believe Abode stole that feature from Freehand before they deep-sixed it. I don't believe you can do a morphed blend with spots tho'.
Retired - CS6 on my 2012 gen MacBook Pro