Since the free version of Logmein has gone away I need to find a better solution. Google's remote desktop works but it's like sucking concrete through a straw. I've tried others with limited success. I want to find a good solution that I don't have to subscribe to.
Matt Beals has given me the idea that a VPN would be the best solution. Here's some info from the Logmein thread.
Quote from: mattbeals on July 08, 2014, 10:51:03 AMhttp://www.amazon.com/s/ref=sr_nr_p_72_0?rh=n%3A172282%2Cn%3A541966%2Ck%3Acisco+vpn+router%2Cp_89%3ACisco%2Cp_72%3A1248879011&keywords=cisco+vpn+router&ie=UTF8&qid=1404837818&rnid=1248877011 (http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=sr_nr_p_72_0?rh=n%3A172282%2Cn%3A541966%2Ck%3Acisco+vpn+router%2Cp_89%3ACisco%2Cp_72%3A1248879011&keywords=cisco+vpn+router&ie=UTF8&qid=1404837818&rnid=1248877011)
http://www.cdw.com/shop/search/result.aspx?key=vpn&wclsscat=&b=&p=&ctlgfilter=&searchscope=all&sr=1 (http://www.cdw.com/shop/search/result.aspx?key=vpn&wclsscat=&b=&p=&ctlgfilter=&searchscope=all&sr=1)
Cisco, Juniper, SonicWall, etc are all great brands with a variety of solutions depending on your needs. Much less expensive to implement now than it was a few years ago. Keeps getting less and less expensive.
If you want to be really frugal about it you can use tools like Untangle who has a free vpn as part of their free package. https://www.untangle.com/store/openvpn.html (https://www.untangle.com/store/openvpn.html)
Untangle also sells additional modules for various things like content filters, spam blockers, virus protection at the gateway, IP failover, load balancing, AD integration, caching proxy server, etc. Plus they have professional services to help get it up and running and stay running.
That has me quite interested. I do have some questions though.
1: Cost. There are some less expensive options. What do I get with the more costly options? I'd happily pay more for easier administration and possibly more speed if that's possible.
2: Administration. How difficult is it to configure and maintain? Do I need to be a CNA or can someone with good knowledge of computers implement it in a Mac/PC environment?
3: Security. Does it create a hole where hackers and exploit? If so what I do to mitigate the risks?
4: Ease of use. Can others here who's knowledge of computers ends at the big button turns it on use it easily? Are there apps for mobile devices? I do see VPN apps in playstore.
More questions to come as I try and learn more about this.
Different solutions offer different levels of performance, features, concurrent users, etc.
It's not difficult to maintain, having a network engineer/outsourced IT service put it in would be advisable. But anyone can do it.
There are http vpn's or client based vpn's. The whole point of a VPN is to create a secure connection into your network. There are several ways of doing it, all of them are encrypted to one degree or another. They're all considered very secure. Hackers can try to get in but they won't break it. What is easier to do is to hack the machine the VPN is running on. Be smart and you won't have a problem. If you find something has gone awry you can always regenerate the keys and certificates, change passwords, disable users, etc.
They're super simple to use if you have a client app. Run the client, put in the username/password or just the password and you're connected. http ssl vpn's you simply log into a webpage and the vpn tunnel is easily created. Works on phones, tablets, computers, etc. All depends on what you want and what your budget is.
In my reading I see there is a mobile VPN that's tailored to mobile devices. VPN works great when you're behind a device that isn't mobile but if you need an on the go solution then a normal VPN won't do what you need. VPN uses your IP to create a secure tunnel but when you are hopping from cell to cell or AP to AP it breaks the connection.
Still trying to get my head around the whole thing. The mobile sounds nice but it's probably cost prohibitive.
Behind a device that isn't mobile? I'm confused.
VPN tunnel on mobile phones work well. The cellular network is designed to keep connections persistent as one cell tower hands off to another. IP itself wants to be able to keep the connection established. Built into TCP/IP are checksums and bits of redundancy to retransmit lost or dropped packets. Your cell phone keeps a steady IP address for some period of time. The VPN software will generally attempt to re-establish the VPN tunnel if it breaks. There are limitations to how well that can work. But generally you aren't in a moving car at 50 mph with a mobile hotspot logged into an RDC connection on your cell phone. If you're sitting at home, a restaurant, Starbucks, etc it's not a problem. Mobile doesn't mean more expensive.
Realistically where are you accessing it from? A remote fixed location. You aren't likely to be truly mobile in that you are moving when using the VPN. It is likely to be that you are mobile, then stop, make the vpn connection, work, disconnect, resume being mobile.
Behind a device that isn't mobile? Sitting at home behind my PC, at home on my laptop, sitting at a desk with a computer doing work remotely.
Normally I would be doing just that. Sitting in one spot taking care of a job. If I'm at my house, a friends, camping using my phone to tether or whatever and then returning to my life that isn't printing. For that VPN works fine.
I've been expected to send jobs through while I'm a passenger on a road trip to the track or something. If I'm not driving then I'm not doing anything as the boss thinks. I can interrupt my time off to take care of our most recent life or death printing job. From what I read the mobile VPN is more suited to that than a standard VPN.
It was just something that came up while researching. I also saw software solutions like SoftEther (https://www.softether.org/) and Open VPN. (https://openvpn.net/) but I'm not done looking into those yet.
I have no basis for my opinion but I want a hardware solution rather than software. I guess it stems from knowing hardware solutions tend to work better and are faster than software solutions. Example: If I had the choice between a hardware based NIC and a driver based NIC that offloads the processing to the CPU I'd go with the hardware option.
Farabomb, take a look at the link Matt posted for https://www.untangle.com/store/openvpn.html. (https://www.untangle.com/store/openvpn.html.) You can install that on an old PC and make your own hardware device. I have about 3 unused PC's at work so I can use one of them to put that on. You can set it up to use as your main firewall then. Haven't had time to start playing yet though.
Software based VPN's aren't really any different than hardware VPN's. There are VPN accelerators and concentrators. But that's different than what you're looking for. A $400 SonicWall/Cisco/Linksys VPN router will handle what you want. The Untangle UTM will handle what you want.
Using your phone while moving in a car you are not using the phone to log into the VPN. You are using the mobile hotspot feature to create a wifi network that your laptop can use. Your laptop establishes the VPN via your personal hotspot via the cellular modem.
If you're talking about signing into the VPN from your cell phone many phones have built into the OS support for VPN's. Others have client apps for doing that. For what you're doing there isn't much reason that you would need a vpn client on your phone to log into a webpage. Unless you want to surf privately at a hotel or something where you don't want your content filtered. But if you're doing that you probably shouldn't be using the work VPN to surf those sites.
Forget "mobile" devices and connecting. Think WiFi (which includes your phones WiFi hotspot feature) and wired connections.
Hmm, I do have 3 rackmounts sitting idle. They are old and from our old Apogee system but I have a feeling they will work. Are the hardware specs reasonable?
Off to go read that link.
Okay, mobileVPN is off the list then. It was more of something I saw while reading than something that I "needed".
Very reasonable. It'll run on most anything.
Quote from: Farabomb on July 10, 2014, 01:05:07 PMHmm, I do have 3 rackmounts sitting idle. They are old and from our old Apogee system but I have a feeling they will work. Are the hardware specs reasonable?
Off to go read that link.
Okay, mobileVPN is off the list then. It was more of something I saw while reading than something that I "needed".
http://wiki.untangle.com/index.php/Hardware_Requirements (http://wiki.untangle.com/index.php/Hardware_Requirements)
I'm still looking at VPN options and so far the Softether VPN seems to be a better choice than Open VPN. Softether supports the open VPN protocol along with 3 other protocols.
I'll post up more info as I try to understand it.
Well I've gotten the server up and managed to connect my netbook to it.
Now here is the question, how the hell do I use this to remotely control the computers on my network? I need to be like I'm sitting at my desk and as of now I can't figure that part out.
Damn my head hurts.
I was hoping you were going to tell the rest of us how that works. :tongue:
Yea, I'm a little lost on that bit right now.
What OS did you use on the server? And did you use Softether VPN?
Right now, just for testing it's XP and softetherVPN. If it ends up working I will be installing win7 and going at it again.
I'm wondering if I go though the VPN and use google remote desktop the connection would be more stable and therefore more usable.
I can see the whole network but the Mac.
I might have some time tonight to drag out our old CTP pc and install an OS and softetherVPN. Actually it already has XP on it so I may just use that for now.
The install wasn't bad at all. Connecting to the PC was easy. Android I haven't been able to get connected.
io9.com has a deal for a paid VPN for secure browsing and such. $20 for 3 years of service so I figured what the hell.
We actually have three older (s-l-o-w) computers that got replaced (one OSX prepress workstation, one Windows with SmartBoard, and a second Windows prepress workstation) that we stuck up in the rafters for emergencies. If something catastrophic ever occurs, we can yank one of those boxes down and hook it up temporarily while we fix the problem.
I'm happy for you Digi.
Back to this pain in the ass. I can ping the mac remotely but it doesn't show up in network, I can't find it with any of the sharing options in preferences. :huh:
So you can go from Windows to Mac, but not Mac to Windows? Have you created a Macintosh share? This is moot if you have extremez-ip.
I can ping the mac from the PC but I can't see it anywhere.
I presume the Mac is on the same workgroup? Can you see the PC from the Mac?
I'll scroll back and see what OS's you're using on both machines.
Quote from: Farabomb on August 22, 2014, 09:46:58 AMI can ping the mac from the PC but I can't see it anywhere.
What exactly are you wanting to do with the mac. You are logged into to the PC through the VPN how? SSH? Remote Desktop of some sort? or how?
I can see all the PCs except my netbook from the Mac.
On the netbook I can see everything but the Mac.
OSes are XP for the vnc box, win7 for the netbook and 10.6.8 on the Mac.
The PC is going through my cell connection (need to be on a outside network for the VNC) through the VNC. The connection seems to be Direct TCP/IP or so it says.
I just set up PrintSmith access via VPN on a Netgear router last week, but I was going Mac-to-Mac. I had to punch a hole in the firewall with an access port. It is set up through TCP. I don't know your Mac's port.
Quote from: Farabomb on August 22, 2014, 09:58:56 AMI can see all the PCs except my netbook from the Mac.
On the netbook I can see everything but the Mac.
OSes are XP for the vnc box, win7 for the netbook and 10.6.8 on the Mac.
The PC is going through my cell connection (need to be on a outside network for the VNC) through the VNC. The connection seems to be Direct TCP/IP or so it says.
OK so you can ping the mac through that VPN connection. What are you trying to do with it?
I was going to try and remote into the Mac but it's not playing nice.
Now I have a new issue of a cover to print first thing monday, no fucking paper and the pressmen are off monday so I have to plead.
Yeah, the boss is already gone so I have to do it.
I use JumpDesktop app on the tablet to access my Mac at work. It's RDP/VNC and it has worked well for me. I use it on iPad but I think they have it for PC and Android too.
It can be a bit laggy at times, but I expect that, working remotely.
Have you tried PC Anywhere?
:lmao:
This is more of a learning experience than actually needing it. I can use google remote but it's like working on a quadra. Click, wait, wait, cursor blinks, type, wait, wait, wait, text appears. What would take 20 minutes here turns into an hour at home.
At least I have beer there. :laugh:
Don't you have to treat your VPN server like a router and open ports within the VPN Server that you need? For example, to do VNC through a firewall you have to open ports 5900 and 5901 to VNC to your Mac. To use VNC you will also need to enable the VNC portion of Mac OS X Screen Sharing. And you would have to open port 5900 to do Mac OS X Screen Sharing from Mac to Mac. To SSH into your Mac you have to enable remote SSH in your sharing prefs and then open Port 22 I think. Still haven't got the VPN server installed here.
:goodpost:
You can very well be right. Hopefully I can play with it monday.
OK FB...I think I have this working. Whew...not as simple as one might think to get the functionality I wanted but...
Based on what you have said you were doing I assume you are wanting to VPN in from a Windows PC or an Android device and you have connected successfully to the VPN you set up. And I am also going to assume that you set it up to use VPN Azure in the SoftEther initial setup since you didn't mention that you opened any ports on your firewall. VPN Azure setup makes this possible (to not have to open any ports) and the connection works fine from a Windows PC using the built in Windows Networking and I assume it works from the Android device since I think you said that is how you connected. You can see the Mac IP but you can't connect it for file sharing or remote access, correct?
To use file sharing so you can connect to your Mac and see your files you have to enable SMB in File Sharing on the Mac. See attachment #1. Screen shots are from OS X 9.4 so your screen may look a little different on OS X 10.6.8 but it is basically the same setup. Once you have that enabled and created a share with the proper permissions you should be able to connect to the Mac and be able to access files on your Mac.
For remote access to your Mac you are either going to have to enable VNC in the Mac OS X Screen Sharing and give it a password. See attachment #2. Then access it by a VNC client that can connect to a Mac
or
You will need to use a client like Team Viewer with it installed on both the Windows and Mac. Not sure if they have an Android client or not.
The Mac address that you use for both methods is the LAN IP Address and not the WAN IP address. For example your LAN IP of your Mac would be something like 192.168.1.### because when you connect via VPN you can treat all of the computers as local machines so there is no need to have to open any kind of ports or to have to forward any ports via your firewall. This only applies to the SoftEther setup if you ARE using VPN Azure.
Now for the turd in the punchbowl for me. I want to VPN in from a Mac. Unfortunately you cannot do this if you are using VPN Azure. At least no way I could make it work so I had to turn off VPN Azure. As soon as I did this I could no longer log into the VPN at all from a Mac or Windows using their respective built-in VPN connections. So after some searching I found that I had to open ports 443 (HTTPS), 500 UDP, 1701 UDP, and 4500 UDP on my work Firewall and forward them to my VPN Server Windows 7 PC. Once I did that I could FINALLY VPN in from my Mac and I could then access my entire work network as if they are local on my home network. Including using the built is OS X Screen Sharing so I do not have to use anything like Team Viewer or a VNC Client. And since I have the Microsoft RDP app for the Mac I can also remote access into to my Windows boxes as if they were local too. The only downside is that I can no longer connect from Windows PC at home using the built in Windows networking connections. But I can by using the SoftEther Windows client app and everything works fine on the Windows side with that.
So success on this end but I spent a day and half fighting it to get it to work how I wanted it to work.
Was there a glitch in the matrix? I swore there were more posts yesterday.
I've been stuck in the back packing boxes so I haven't had a chance to try any of this.
I had to make a couple of changes in the post and deleted the fluff after it and reposted the main post.
So running into an issue on my Mac now. I thought it was working properly Sunday and Monday but now if I connect to the VPN with my Mac I lose my local internet on the Mac. Also I can't connect via the local Mac to file shares on the work network now and I know I could the other day. But I can still remote access in so not sure what the issue is now. Might need to reboot my local Mac.
The other thing I am a little concerned with using SoftEther is that you have to connect via xyz.softether.net (where xyz is the name you choose during setup). SoftEther is out of Japan so I think that means your VPN is connecting through Japan. Not really sure how that works but what seems like it was working two days ago doesn't seem to be working correctly now.
Time Warner is having issues so if any of the nodes are on that maybe that's it.
I don't think that is it. It is working flawlessly on the Windows 7 and Windows 8 PC. Ya hear that Steve Jobs Tim Cook?
Quote from: Joe on August 27, 2014, 11:43:08 AMSo running into an issue on my Mac now. I thought it was working properly Sunday and Monday but now if I connect to the VPN with my Mac I lose my local internet on the Mac. Also I can't connect via the local Mac to file shares on the work network now and I know I could the other day. But I can still remote access in so not sure what the issue is now. Might need to reboot my local Mac.
The other thing I am a little concerned with using SoftEther is that you have to connect via xyz.softether.net (where xyz is the name you choose during setup). SoftEther is out of Japan so I think that means your VPN is connecting through Japan. Not really sure how that works but what seems like it was working two days ago doesn't seem to be working correctly now.
This must have been an issue with my home iMac. Got around to restarting it this morning and everything seems to be working correctly again. Connected to VPN on Mac and still have internet working on the home iMac.
Do you notice any improvements in speed or stability of connection over something like google desktop or logmein? That's what I'm really going for over security.
OS X Screen sharing is rock solid but that has to be Mac to Mac.
For Windows to Windows or even Mac to Windows (but there is no Windows to Mac) you will NOT find a better Remote Desktop app than Microsoft Remote Desktop that is built into Windows. It is both the fastest and the most stable.
If you have to do Windows to Mac I would try either Real, Ultra, or Tight VNC Client. I've had pretty good luck with all of them connecting to the built in Mac VNC Server.
Yea, I have to go from Win at home to Mac at work. I have VNC here to go from PC to a PC off the internet so I can remote into it from home.
Example, I have to remote in to do a job. Right now I use google remote desktop to remote into the Mac. I do all the work on the Mac and submit it for proof, imposed PDF and send it to plate. In order to confirm that the plates made it to the queue I use Win remote desktop on the Mac to remote into the prinergy server. Then from there I use VNC to hit the platesetter that's isolated from the internet. I can tell if the plates made it and release them in case the pressmen have gone dumb.
Once you use VPN everything is local so you don't have to worry about a machine not having access to the internet so you can actually use MRD from your home PC to your Prinergy and CTP PC. Just use their local IP address from you home iMac once you are connected to the VPN.
Windows to Mac though means using what you are now or something like Team Viewer etc...
So basically I should just pony up for logmein because that worked the best before it went to a paid service. At that point I wouldn't even need the VPN. :shoots_self:
No. The best option would be to make your brother buy you a Mac for home since you have to do work from there.
Still would have to transfer the files on my one step up from smoke signal connection. Remoting in takes 2-3x longer than if I was sitting at the computer. Doing the work on my home computer, then uploading would raise that to 5-10x longer.
Simplest thing would be inform the customer that if they really, REALLY need it now there will be a $200 remote charge for not sending files during business hours.
I won't hold my breath for that.
You still wouldn't need to work the files at home. You could log in Mac to Mac. Then fix them on the Work Mac. The built in OS X Screen Sharing is the best Remote Desktop for Mac to Mac connections. You could also Remote in to your Prinergy and CTP Windows PC's from your home Mac too.
Once you get your VPN up and running, you can spoof your IP to be out of the area or overseas, and then you can watch local blacked-out sporting events.
I have that on my PC and android. Connects to whatever outside server I choose so no region restrictions.
I have come to the conclusion that the VPN isn't going to work for what I need. I have to go cross platform and it seems it's more trouble than it's worth. One more box to deal with, one more thing that can hiccup and make troubleshooting that much more difficult.
Google remote desktop "works" but at times there is tremendous lag. It's probably due to my DSL connection at home. What I may do is call my provider and see if there is an upgraded speed I gan get. If that solves it, I'll pitch it to the boss for him to pay for my upgraded speed.
Yeah, a VPN won't fix the whole Mac to PC to Mac issue and it won't make it any faster that the slowest point in the connection. But it will make it more secure. I need access to a few Windows servers and my work iMac at times and I don't like leaving VNC or OS X Screen Sharing open to the whole world to try to exploit so a VPN is good for preventing that. A couple of years ago someone got into our Prinergy server via RDP and created a little havoc. After that I limited the connections to my home IP address which works fine until my ISP gives me a new IP address and I don't find out until the next I try to remote in and am locked out.
Hey Farabomb, have you seen this?
Check out LogMeIn Hamachi:
What Is LogMeIn Hamachi?- LogMeIn Hamachi is a virtual networking service that can be set up in minutes and enables secure remote access
to your business network anywhere there is an Internet connection.
- Unlike traditional hardware and software based VPN systems, Hamachi is an on-demand virtual networking service
that allows you to focus your time and energy on providing the remote connections your users and systems need,
and not the technology or infrastructure you are using to support them.
QuoteHamachi clients can be members of any network; however, depending on the network owner's Hamachi subscription,
networks have the following limitations:
• Free subscription allows you to have five members in a network
• Standard subscription allows you to have 32 members in a network
• Premium subscription allows you to have 256 members in a network
• Multi-network subscription or a LogMeIn Central subscription allows you to have 256 members in all your networks
The Standard subscription of 1 network with from 6 up to 32 members runs $29 per year. This sounds like a "too good to be true" deal for it to only be $29 per year and not have to mess with setting up and maintaining your own VPN Server. I am going to setup the free service (for up to 5 members and see how it goes)
Here is the User Guide: http://test.b4print.com/downloads/LogMeIn_Hamachi_UserGuide.pdf
This works great. No softetherVPN software to setup and configure on a PC. No firewall settings to mess with. Just create your network on the LogMeIn Hamachi website, download the client and install onto your Mac or PC. Request to join the network. Go back to the website and accept the request. Using this I can connect to my Mac at home or work using Apple Screen Sharing or if I don't need screen sharing I can mount my Mac shares on the desktop of the Mac I am at like they are local drives. Pretty sweet. And I can still add up to 3 more devices (Mac, PC, or mobile) under the Free plan.
I might even suggest we get the $29 per year plan at work so my co-workers can access their Macs from home too and let them get the 3:00 am calls on a Sunday morning to fix their jobs instead of me getting that call! :evil:
I would need a PC to Mac remote desktop solution like they used to offer for free. This can't be the same for free.
They will probably pull the same as with logmein. Get you hooked and them charge like a corner drug dealer.
Quote from: Farabomb on October 30, 2014, 08:54:18 AMI would need a PC to Mac remote desktop solution like they used to offer for free. This can't be the same for free.
They will probably pull the same as with logmein. Get you hooked and them charge like a corner drug dealer.
You should be able to use RealVNC or TightVNC Client for Windows to connect to your Mac. You just have to tell your Mac to allow VNC connections in your screen sharing preferences.
Well for now is 5 devices for free which is just OK but there are no guarantees.
What if I like Real-TightVNC? :naughty: squeaky squeaky squeaky
That one isn't free! ;D
do you get a happy ending?
Yep, and a glazed donut.