Converting CMYK 'mono' pics but leave all else intact.

Started by frailer, August 08, 2016, 06:36:26 PM

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Joe

Quote from: DigitalCrapShoveler on August 09, 2016, 11:14:37 PMI know I'm gonna catch shit for this, but I really never had very good luck with converting 4-color grays to black only with Pitstop. The problem I always had, was the converted image was just too dark and concentrated and plugged up bad on press, especially with offset substrates.

I manually opened every image in PS, run levels to balance it, then run an action with curves set to add 5% dot in the highlights and take the shadows down to 85 - 90%. It gives the Press guys a little more room to maneuver and does not plug up with offset paper.

It takes longer, but once you get into a groove, it goes pretty quick.

I agree about not liking any end result with Pitstop. They are either too light or too dark it seems. But you can do corrections within Pitstop now so I don't really feel the need to open them in Photoshop unless it is a special case. My go to right now is to use the 'Acrobat' setting in Pitstop CM and then do a curve change 92% to 100% within Pitstop and it looks pretty good.

Quote from: elko on August 10, 2016, 12:03:48 AMand what about change color (dot gain 15% works fine) by acrobat?.....it should leave text 100K and change only objects in CMYK and so on

Yeah I've tried that but I still don't like the quality of the images being converted. Either too dark or too light for my liking.
Mac OS Sonoma 14.2.1 (c) | (retired)

The seven ages of man: spills, drills, thrills, bills, ills, pills and wills.

DigitalCrapShoveler

Quote from: Joe on August 10, 2016, 07:08:35 AM
Quote from: DigitalCrapShoveler on August 09, 2016, 11:14:37 PMI know I'm gonna catch shit for this, but I really never had very good luck with converting 4-color grays to black only with Pitstop. The problem I always had, was the converted image was just too dark and concentrated and plugged up bad on press, especially with offset substrates.

I manually opened every image in PS, run levels to balance it, then run an action with curves set to add 5% dot in the highlights and take the shadows down to 85 - 90%. It gives the Press guys a little more room to maneuver and does not plug up with offset paper.

It takes longer, but once you get into a groove, it goes pretty quick.

I agree about not liking any end result with Pitstop. They are either too light or too dark it seems. But you can do corrections within Pitstop now so I don't really feel the need to open them in Photoshop unless it is a special case. My go to right now is to use the 'Acrobat' setting in Pitstop CM and then do a curve change 92% to 100% within Pitstop and it looks pretty good.

Quote from: elko on August 10, 2016, 12:03:48 AMand what about change color (dot gain 15% works fine) by acrobat?.....it should leave text 100K and change only objects in CMYK and so on

Yeah I've tried that but I still don't like the quality of the images being converted. Either too dark or too light for my liking.

Well, I haven't had to do it in over a year. Getting behind the times, pretty quick. :shoots_self:
Member #285 - Civilian

abc

Ok so we have some work to do.  :-)
If anyone is interested, could you send me, PitStop result, acceptable result you created elsewhere, and your PitStop color management settings.
We can then take a look at how we can improve.

Joe

Quote from: abc on August 10, 2016, 08:30:47 AMOk so we have some work to do.  :-)
If anyone is interested, could you send me, PitStop result, acceptable result you created elsewhere, and your PitStop color management settings.
We can then take a look at how we can improve.

I'll find some examples and get them to you. Today I hope.
Mac OS Sonoma 14.2.1 (c) | (retired)

The seven ages of man: spills, drills, thrills, bills, ills, pills and wills.

DigitalCrapShoveler

Quote from: abc on August 10, 2016, 08:30:47 AMOk so we have some work to do.  :-)
If anyone is interested, could you send me, PitStop result, acceptable result you created elsewhere, and your PitStop color management settings.
We can then take a look at how we can improve.

I wish I could. I longer work in Prepress. I admire the fact you want to get this resolved, however.
Member #285 - Civilian

abc

Well it's what you would expect isn't it?
Not sure if we need some better ICC profiles or maybe some kind of adjustment options like you have in Photoshop.
Then again one size doesn't always fit all in these cases.
But we can certainly look and improve what we do now, or at least have additional options.

Joe

Quote from: abc on August 10, 2016, 09:23:31 AMWell it's what you would expect isn't it?

Have you ever dealt with Adobe? :rotf:

It is the last thing I expect from them.
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The seven ages of man: spills, drills, thrills, bills, ills, pills and wills.

Farabomb

Pretty sure DCS is not accustomed to a helpful provider in the print industry. I know it's pretty damn foreign to me and I thank that you and you team are so helpful.

Joe's response just supports my post.  :rotf:
Speed doesn't kill, rapidly becoming stationary is the problem

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Quote from: Farabomb on April 06, 2016, 11:39:41 AMIt's more like grip, grip, grip, noise, then spin and 2 feet in and feel shame.
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My other job

abc

Maybe it helps that I used to be a prepress manager, so I feel your pain. Weird that I actually bought PitStop version 1 in Acrobat 3 when I was in production, and here I am now looking after it.
Strange how life works out some times

Ear

It comforts me greatly that the product mgr of PitStop has been in the prepress trenches.

:winner:
"... profile says he's a seven-foot tall ex-basketball pro, Hindu guru drag queen alien." ~Jet Black

DigitalCrapShoveler

Quote from: abc on August 10, 2016, 09:23:31 AMWell it's what you would expect isn't it?
Not sure if we need some better ICC profiles or maybe some kind of adjustment options like you have in Photoshop.
Then again one size doesn't always fit all in these cases.
But we can certainly look and improve what we do now, or at least have additional options.

Expectations are one thing, a software company actually following though and actually helping is another thing entirely.

Not something I have seen in a LONG time, I mean we're talking Freehand 5 days. I too, feel better knowing a Prepress guy is taking care of business. Puts things in total perspective.
Member #285 - Civilian

frailer

Sorry, only caught this back up when about to leave for early Friday knock-off.. woo! (gotta get moving and get wife's guitar saddle replaced... or I'll get demoted).

Joe, if you haven't sent ABC that stuff, I'll endeavour to Monday morning (ours, not yours  :P  ).

Post-tooling with compadra yesterday... seemed the 'Japan Prepress.." was the only one that gave a good 'macro/EAL' result.
But then again, it may also depend on the incoming files, how created, how saved... So, as always, a suck'n'see.
All's know is, it's made me more ready to jump in & try a few different settings on an Extracted page. In this case they were quite dark cmyk-monos. That setting really knocked em back good in the act of Gray'ing them.

Have a lovely weekend, y'all, when it gets to you...
Forgotten good guys: Dennis Ritchie, Burrell Smith, Bill Atkinson, Richard Stallman
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Now just an honorary member.

abc

Maybe take a look at this webinar from March 2015?
https://enfocus.webex.com/enfocus/lsr.php?RCID=5c57638d29eb41fcf1009fad1d9d1ae0

3 diffferent ways to get from CMYK to Gray. Starts around 21 minutes in.

Joe

Here is a PDF with 4 color black & white photos. None of the existing settings convert these to what I really like. Grayscale_CMYK.pdf
Mac OS Sonoma 14.2.1 (c) | (retired)

The seven ages of man: spills, drills, thrills, bills, ills, pills and wills.

abc

Great, can you send me a version of how you would like them to look in Grayscale, and also some information on the settings or corrections you did?